The Future of E-commerce

Scheduled for: November 30th, 2021, 12:00 pm PT / Category: Interviews

Innovating the online retail experience with artificial intelligence that combines real-time payments, data privacy and social e-commerce.

Albert Saniger is the founder and CEO at nate, the first app with the technology to enable mobile checkout on behalf of a user for any item at any online retailer.

Receiving his MBA at London Business School, Albert worked briefly on Amazon’s Fashion Retail platform and in 2018 founded nate with a mission to simplify and transform the online shopping experience into a social one. By April 2020, nate had closed the largest series seed round for a consumer software company of the year and launched to the public that summer.

Podcast

 

Transcript

Tullio Siragusa:

Good afternoon, everyone. Welcome back to another episode of dojo.live. Today is Tuesday, November 30th, 2021. I’m Tullio Siragusa. Joining me are Carlos Ponce in Cuernavaca, Mexico, and Kim Lantis and Hermosillo, Mexico. Hey guys. Welcome back.

Albert Saniger:

Pleasure to be here, as ever.

Tullio Siragusa:

Our guest today is Albert Saniger who’s the founder and CEO at Nate, nate.tech. Welcome to the show Albert. It’s good to have you. We’re going to be talking about e-commerce and the future – together. But before we get into the topic of conversation today, let’s get to know Nate a little bit. Who’s our guest. Thanks for being with us. I’m sorry, Albert. Does that happen to you a lot?

Albert Saniger:

All the time. You listen to other speaking engagements that I’ve done, it’s pretty much 90% of the time. And I always say, you know what? Albert is a human, Nate is the machine. Nate is a machine that lives in the cloud and does things for you, Albert is a given.

Tullio Siragusa:

But you know what? You’re wearing that cap that says Nate. So I’m like, “Oh, his name is Nate.” I just easily confused myself to call you Nate.

Albert Saniger:

At this point I’ll just change my name to Nate. It’ll be better.

Tullio Siragusa:

Let’s get to know Albert. Albert, tell us a little bit about yourself.

Albert Saniger:

Thank you guys for having me. I’m a big fan of the show. A little bit about me. So I’m Spanish, I grew up between Spain and France and then I moved to California for college. And now I live in New York city with my husband and my four month old daughter. I love doing yoga. And I have been an e-commerce payments and AI freak for a few years. Some of those things may not feel like they make sense with each other, but they do at the company I run. I have, in terms of my career, I’ve been a founder for most of my life, except for a period at Amazon after business school. And three years ago, I started with Nate and I’ve been doing this for a while now.

Tullio Siragusa:

All right. Tell us about Nate. What is Nate all about? Nate, the company, the company.

Albert Saniger:

All right. So I’ll tell you that Nate, the company, so Nate is the world’s first universal shopping app. What does that mean? That means that as a consumer, if you live in the U.S. and you have an iOS device, you can download it, sign up and give me your name, email, shipping address, and any payment information that you want. And you will never have to manually check out on websites ever again. Nate consolidates all of your purchases into a single place. You can skip the checkout anywhere. We automatically apply all publicly available discounts. You can pay later if you want to, you can split your payment into four installments. Also, Nate is the world’s most private way of buying online because we issue single use virtual cards for every purchase. We also become merchant of record. So your bank or credit card network don’t know what you’re buying.

Albert Saniger:

And then the transaction happens on our servers and not on your browser. So nobody can place a cookie on your browser saying that you bought that. So we basically build the entire value curve for the non-Amazon economy and telling consumers, yes, it is possible for you to have an Amazon like experience consistent, seamless, and private for the rest of the world, which is 2.1 million retailers in the U.S. There is also a whole fun social side to it, which you can save items, create lists, share lists with friends who can follow them and buy things directly from them. There’s a creator – we have a creator economy product and I could talk for hours about it. But the summary is the world’s first and only universal shopping.

Tullio Siragusa:

Bold. Awesome. All right, let’s see what we can learn today. Unpack this a little bit and learn everything we can about it. So, who’s introducing the topic of conversation today?

Kim Lantis:

I can go ahead and do that. Thank you Tullio and thank you Albert for being here. I think there might be a slight delay. So if I talk over someone, I apologize. Today’s topic is the future e-commerce, which I think Albert unpacked for us quite well already with his description of Nate, but more specifically, we’re going to be talking about innovating the online retail experience with Artificial Intelligence that combines real-time payments, data, privacy, and social e-commerce. So thank you. Albert, my question for you is, Nate seems to be doing a lot. What was the genesis for you that gave birth to this idea of “We need this.” Was it the privacy? Was it, what was the ultimate foundation?

Albert Saniger:

Gosh. I feel like there was, there were a lots of moving pieces over the prior kind of three decades of my life that colluded into this moment. If I were to summarize what was going through my head three years ago, I was working at Amazon and I realized, I’m a big fan of Amazon by the way. Such an easy experience every time, not just the app, but anybody now, there’s an Amazon Go store across the street from my office here in New York city on Park Avenue South. You walk in, you grab a sandwich and you walk out. There’s no checkout whatsoever. And this notion that consumers should disengage from this concept of, let me go out of my way to do all these heavy lifting things in order to pay, you know, just take my money. I want to buy this right now and move on with my life, right?

Albert Saniger:

And I’m still to this day, a big fan of Amazon. So I was working there and I’m realizing that Amazon was gaining so much market share. So for context, global e-commerce is a $4 trillion business. Four trillion dollar market, sorry, actually probably $5 trillion almost this year. The U.S. represents $900 billion of that. So almost a trillion, almost a fifth of that. And Amazon is 41% of U.S. e-commerce. That means that there’s still a 60% of it, or 59% of it, that is non-Amazon. And that is distributed across a long tale of 2.1 million retailers. And both of my parents are entrepreneurs or, or people who kind of created their own SMEs in Spain. And I sort of like love the idea of people being able to, you know, create businesses as opposed to e-commerce being this sort of like global duopoly of Amazon and Alibaba, which I don’t have anything against.

Albert Saniger:

I just, I find, I found that that was a little bit sad if that was the direction the world is going towards. And then the second thing is the alternative to a world where only Amazon and Alibaba are, you know, basically lead, let’s say 90% of global e-commerce. If that happened, which I hope it doesn’t, the alternative would be a world where all of those other millions of retailers would have to somehow share a lot of consumer data with each other in order to offer certain types of experiences. And that would start eating into one of the fundamental rights of Western democracies, which is consumer privacy. I’m a political science major, former math and C++ nerd, but I actually ended up majoring in political sciences. And one of the things that matters most to me, I think is a fundamental pillar of democracy is, is privacy.

Albert Saniger:

You owning your own data. And I sort of put two and two together and I figured, I asked myself, is there a way to create an Amazon-like experience that built on top of all the other 2.1 million U.S. retailers, ensures that there is a diverse, competitive market where companies thrive. And at the same time, we don’t have to give up on consumer privacy and people owning their own data. And if you see what’s been happening over the last few quarters with Facebook, and all these other companies that are basically using your data as consumers, to turn it into a product, and it’s sort of like we have to pick, right. And I don’t want to pick, I want a world where I can, I want to be able to buy from anywhere. And I want to decide who I share that information with. I can tell my friends that I bought a Peloton, but I don’t want to tell this random algorithm from a third party company that I never had an interaction with.

Kim Lantis:

Exactly. The fear of the fallout. I love it. And the alternative. Cool. Carlos.

Carlos Ponce:

Yeah, I got, I have a question for you, Albert. Okay. Let’s say I download Nate here. And then I can, it seems that this would be great. It would prevent me from, it would prevent me from having to deal with the bunch of other sites from many, many, many retailers. Right. That’s my assumption, correct?

Albert Saniger:

Yep.

Carlos Ponce:

Okay. So how do I, what can you tell me, the end user, that will guarantee that I will feel at ease? That my data is going to be safe? Especially sensitive data like credit card numbers, you know, those kinds of things. Is there any kind of encryption involved or how do you, what do you do to protect the information? How is this protected?

Albert Saniger:

So let me clarify a couple of things. Let me tell you what happens, or if you – before Nate existed, okay? So what happens is you go on a website, right? And you buy something. And then right at that moment, someone places a cookie on your browser saying that you bought that. So every time you go to any other website, if they track your cookies, there’ll be able to see that you bought that item. Okay. Now further, what also happens is that you usually, probably for the most part, use your own credit card or debit card to make a purchase. And that means that the retailer that you give that credit card to is, is allowed to take the last four digits of that payment information, and then sell it to third parties saying, “Carlos placed his order here,” or, you know, presumably is Carlos, cause they have a profile of you if that makes sense.

Albert Saniger:

They’re not allowed to sell your name or other personally identifying information, but they build this profile of you that exists. And it’s tied to the last four digits of your credit card. And then the third thing that happens is that your actual bank that issued that card and the card network in this case, MasterCard or Visa or American Express, are also aware of what you’re buying. And so that means that there’s all these, and then they are in some cases allowed to also share that information with third parties. Some credit cards don’t, and some credit cards do, some people don’t care about it. Some people prefer just to get points and they go with the highest points credit cards, and they don’t look at the fine print saying that what’s happening. Have you ever received mail at your house, Carlos, the physical mail from a company that you’ve never interacted with?

Albert Saniger:

Has that happened to you? And addressed to you? Yeah. And you wonder how on earth did this company, they sell shoes, right? Why do they have my name? And the reason is because your credit card company is selling your data to them. Right? And so what happens with Nate, with me, what happens is that every time you make a purchase, we issue a single use virtual card number. That means that that card will only be used once and never used again. And then we go to that website and place the order on your behalf, just with that single use card that we have used that is under your name, but only exists for that period of time. And then that means nobody can take the last four digits of that card and sell it to third parties. On top of that, we then become merchant of record.

Albert Saniger:

What does that mean? That means that we appear on your card statement or your bank statement. It says, Nate, it doesn’t say the retailer where you bought it from. These people can no longer know what you’re buying, because with Nate, you could buy a Peloton or a Tesla or a shampoo, right? And so they don’t know what you’re buying. They see a price, they see a number, but they don’t see the category. They don’t see the retailer. So they don’t, they cannot build a profile of you anymore. And then on top of that, the purchase itself happens on our servers, not on your browser, meaning nobody can place a cookie on your browser saying that you bought that item. Those three things combined make it where Nate, today, is the world’s most private way of buying online. Now you asked me a different question, which I know. Which is now, but you’re telling me, Carlos, “I’m giving you my credit card permission. What do you do with it?” Well, we store it and we charge it. We don’t take it and put it in other places. So that’s the difference here. We store it and we charge your payment information or your bank account, whatever you feel most comfortable with. You can link your bank account to the Nate app as well.

Kim Lantis:

Nice. It’s like criminals used to use single-use mobile phones and now shopaholics get the single use credit card!

Albert Saniger:

That’s right.

Carlos Ponce:

So I don’t have to worry about, I don’t have to worry as a user to not to forget, to check the box that says I do not consent to blah, blah, blah. I don’t have to worry about that. Am I, am I right?

Albert Saniger:

That’s right.

Carlos Ponce:

Okay, perfect. Awesome. Sorry. Okay, perfect. Thank you, Albert. Sorry, Tullio, back to you, please.

Tullio Siragusa:

The technology sounds a bit similar to what Apple just recently introduced where you can mask your email, have these pseudo email. Have you seen that? It’s kind of similar in terms of how it creates a more anonymous kind of experience for the shopper?

Albert Saniger:

Yeah. I love what Apple does in that sense. I mean, it’s a very, yeah, I use it all the time. Sign in with Apple is one of my favorite things ever. Because I retain control of my, of my personal information, such as my name and email. And I love that. So when you buy with Nate, we don’t issue single use emails. So we still use your actual email on the website. And the reason for that is primarily because consumers ask for it. So in some cases, people will buy from a website that they have an account with and they want to collect some points from that retailer. And they don’t mind giving their personal information, like their name and their email to that retailer in particular. They just don’t want that retailer to then sell it to third parties. And they don’t want their payment network and their bank to also know what they’re buying and everyone else and their uncle, but they’re telling that company, “Yeah, I’m giving you my email. Please send me this t-shirt,” right? So that’s fine by us. But we’ve considered single use emails too, it’s just something that we’ve talked to our users about and so far they were less interested about it.

Kim Lantis:

Well, it makes perfect sense because then it gives me the control to choose who I want more information from and who I don’t. It’s the best of both worlds.

Tullio Siragusa:

Let’s see if I understand this correctly. Today, if you go into Amazon or Alibaba, you are a persona, an individual shopping on their platform, the end supplier or store doesn’t really build a relationship with you. They just have their products, you buy it, Amazon facilitates it, et cetera, ships it and all that good stuff. What you’re saying though, is, if I’m understanding this correctly, this allows me to actually – the same way I would go into a store, a physical store – that I get to build a relationship with the retailer, one-on-one – this allows me to create a similar type of experience, but also I get to choose which one I have more pri- you know, the privacy factor, et cetera, the trust that I would want to build. Is this the part of the social shopping experience, where now not only am I building a relationship with the retailer, but also the people that are buying from that retailer I get to connect with and interact and share ideas. Is this beyond just basically reviews? Can you give us a little bit more on how it works?

Albert Saniger:

Yes. So there are – first let me address the point about Amazon and Alibaba for a second. And then I’ll go back to your question. So Amazon has three, amazon.com, not all other businesses like AWS and whatnot, but amazon.com, has three main businesses. One is Amazon retail, which is basically Amazon buying inventory and holding it and then selling it to consumers. It’s held in Amazon distribution centers, but it is owned by Amazon. Separately is marketplace, which is the example you mentioned, which is third-party sellers selling on the Amazon platform. For the most part those products are in the distribution centers of those third party sellers. There’s an exception to that where they ship them to Amazon in advance, but that doesn’t mean that Amazon legally owns them. They haven’t paid them for that until the consumer actually buys them.

And then the third one is private label, which is where Amazon makes its own products from scratch. Now all of those things are operationally intense in order to deliver that sort of like amazing experience for consumers. Now, all the other 2.1 million retailers have a variety of a combination of those things. There’s some direct to consumer retailers that are only private label. They only make their own products and sell them directly on their websites. There are others that are marketplaces where it’s like the second version of what I explained on Amazon. And there’s others that are full traditional retailers, where they buy the inventory, they hold it and then they sell it. My point here is that no matter which method they have, right? All 2 million retailers in the U.S., if you are able to place an order on that website with your fingers, that means you are able to Nate it.

You’re able to ask Nate to buy for you, skip the checkout everywhere, automatically apply discounts everywhere, end-to-end privacy everywhere and financing (pay later) everywhere. Now that is the core value proposition. It’s an Amazon like experience for the consumer in the entire stack of the non-Amazon economy, regardless of what business model these retailers have. Now on top of that, some users, and this is, you know we started doing this because users, you know, our customers asked for it, which was, we realized that some people wanted to not only buy things, but also save them to check them later. And, and so we started allowing that. They would save a few items and then see them in the app later. And then we realized that those people would start, started taking screenshots of their app and share those screenshots with friends. So of course they were using Nate to buy stuff because they didn’t want, they wanted a seamless, consistent, universal, and private experience.

They didn’t want these other third parties and companies to know what they were buying, but they wanted their friends to know what they were buying. So they took screenshots of their purchase history or the items they had saved and shared them with friends via iMessage or Instagram. And then we said, “Wait, wait, wait. You don’t have to take a screenshot. That’s fine. We’ll allow you to share that list with friends.” And so that’s how we started sort of enabling social commerce because people can save items to Nate. It looks like a Pinterest board of sorts. You can save hundreds or thousands, as many as you want, and create separate lists. For example, I could create a list on Nate and I don’t need to buy anything for that. I could just create a list and send it to you guys. It could be like, you know, “Albert’s Workout Essentials” and I could send it to you via text message or I could post it on my Twitter. And then people could tap on that link and follow my list. And so basically it’s an extension of a very natural behavior that humans want, which is, humans want to share. They just want to share with whoever they want to share, right? They want to share with their friends or with their family or with their followers on social media. That doesn’t mean they want to share with algorithms or all these other companies that steal their data.

Kim Lantis:

So this is really great. Let me see if I got this right. And then let’s use this example, we’ve got Christmas coming up. Let’s just pretend that I, Kim, have set myself a budget that I have a total of $600 to spend for this Christmas. Okay? So that is going to include my Christmas dinner, gifts for my daughters, whatever. [Daughter interrupts with candy bag.] Sorry, opening up some candy here, which is probably going to be hard. Of course, it’s going to be one of those stupid, impossible candy bags when you’ve got to do this live! Please go ask your sister, or daddy. Go ask daddy, thank you. So I can go into a grocery store app. I can pick my Christmas dinner. That’s going to pop into a shopping cart in Nate. I then pop over to Target because they’ve got the best price on an LOL doll, put that in, whatever. Come up. I’ve got one shopping cart in Nate, I can see the total of everything I need is $497 – inside my budget – purchase, and “floop!” It’s done?

Albert Saniger:

That’s exactly right. With a difference that we actually don’t use the word “cart.” We don’t like that. We don’t like the word. We like the idea of getting rid of the cart, in a way. It feels like, oh, this was almost like e-commerce –

Kim Lantis:

What is it? What do you call it?

Albert Saniger:

Well, nothing. You just buy it! You know? You create a list, you could create a list and then you can buy, or you can just buy one thing at a time. But, if you think about it, like e-commerce was built on this, on the, on what brick and mortar used to be. Right? So it used to be a world where there were these physical restrictions of, you had to like put things in an actual card, not a digital one, an actual cart. And then you would drive to the cashier and the store associate would kind of check you out.

Albert Saniger:

Right? Cause you know, you had to line up because there was this physical restriction. You can’t just walk out of the store with the things that you want. And then somehow when we built e-commerce, which is modeled after what was happening in brick and mortar, and we called it “cart” as if you had to wait in line with a cart. You don’t have to wait in line with a cart, this is technology! You should be able to buy it out right. So we’re doing away with carts, doing away with baskets. You want to buy it, you buy it, you want to save it, you save it. We’re basically building experiences that are how the human brain works and wants to work as opposed to these restrictions that have happened more because for lack of technology.

Tullio Siragusa:

So I’m curious about that strategy a little bit, because I’m wondering if the conversion rate is also higher for the merchant. What I’m talking about is, sometimes you put something in the cart and then when you go to checkout and you take stuff out of the cart, right? So, whereas this, you go to buy it, you bought it, right? So is there less of a likelihood of someone changing their mind? Is it feeding on this sort of impulse to “I want this, I want it now,” and does it benefit the merchant as well from less so, you know, people changing their mind at the time of checkout? What’s the use case so far that you’ve seen around that? Any comments on that?

Albert Saniger:

No, for sure. It is actually extremely valuable to the merchant. In fact, there are companies that are doing one-click checkout experiences and they’re not doing them for consumers, they are doing them for merchants. So what we do at Nate is we build things for consumers, right? And we are, we don’t make money – we don’t partner with merchants. We don’t have direct relationships with merchants. But there’s a very legitimate argument here. You’re saying what Nate does is also helping the merchant. In fact, I think it was Google that created this report a few years ago, saying that in emotional categories, think categories like fashion, beauty, wellness, so things that are not necessarily ultra rational, like, buying a car or a refrigerator where people are like, like me, you know, being more rational about this.

In emotional categories, every second of additional friction reduces purchase intent by 20%. That means in a matter of seconds, that user no longer wants to buy that item. It’s almost like the equivalent of going into a store and you’re like, “Oh, that t-shirt is cool.” You’re walking down the street. And then, then you like walk in and you’re like, “Let me try it out. You know what? I’ll just buy it.” And then they make you wait 20 minutes in line. “You know, you know what? I don’t need this t-shirt anymore.” Right? Like why do I have to wait 20 minutes in line order to check out at this store? It’s the same thing, just online – with a key difference that over the last few years, one thing that we have realized is that the increase in conversion is less due to the number of seconds and more due to the number of micro decisions.

So what matters most to the consumer is actually not how many seconds it takes to check out, what matters is how many micro decisions they have to make along the way. [Siri says something.] Siri is mad at me right now… So think about it from the perspective of consistency. So if you can buy online using the same steps every time, then you don’t have to think about it. You can stay in System 1 thinking. But if every time it’s like, “Oh, this website is different. Let me like, where am I right now? Okay, let me do this, and that, and that.” That is very taxing for the brain. You can not multitask. You can not do other things at the same time. That is what’s driving the conversion upside. And so then we have tons of retailers reaching out to us and saying, “Wait, wait, wait. We heard that you guys, you know, do this. How do we partner with you?”

And we’re like, “No, you don’t need to.” They’re like, “Wait, what? So consumers can Nate things, buy with Nate and we will get higher conversion and we don’t need to pay you?” And I’m like, “That’s exactly right. I don’t want your money. We’re not interested. We’re not building for those retailers.” I mean, God bless. We want the best. We want a thriving world for retailers. We’re just not building tools for them. And a recent example is a company that reached out asking us to be their pay later provider, because we have a pay later product on top. So consumers can sometimes just pay now or pay later it’s up to them. And that company thought, “Oh, can I integrate? I heard that you don’t charge retailers for pay later product.” And I said, “No, there’s no need for integration.” So that’s the whole point. We’re building this for consumers. We’re an extension of the consumers’ tools and the consumer can use Nate for anything they want. But the retailer doesn’t need to do anything.

Kim Lantis:

So coming back to what you were talking about about the emotional decision-making, the micro decisions I think is what you called them, the time it takes and the social components of seeing people’s lists. Can I purchase someone’s list? So let’s say there’s an influencer. I don’t know the emotional “makeup look.” I want this look, she’s using whatever highlighter in this color, blah, blah, blah. And I want that exact look and I just “purchase list?”

Albert Saniger:

Yep. That’s right. That’s exactly right. It’s like a, almost like a Pinterest board 2.0. You can not only see everything that they have pooled and recommended, but you can buy straight from it.

Kim Lantis:

Without having to go to each retailer’s page?

Albert Saniger:

That’s right. Just one tap.

Exactly. So you’ll see influencers who, for example, post YouTube videos and they say, this is my, you know, beauty makeup routine in the morning. And then here are the links below. Instead of links below, for the most part, right now, they’re just adding in one link, which is the link to their Nate list. And all those products are already there and the consumers can buy them directly from there. In fact, we announced the creator economy product that gives creators 5% cash into their Nate wallet every time someone buys something from their list. And that basically simplifies a very complex step for creators and it allows them to recommend truly what they want to recommend as opposed to relying on specific brand partnerships.

Carlos Ponce:

Albert, we’re approaching the final set of today’s conversation, and I wouldn’t want to end it without asking you what’s working for Nate like? And I’m asking this because we might have viewers out there who could be probably, I don’t know, designers, engineers, who might have an interest in the company and might want to reach out to you. What would you say to these folks? What makes Nate an awesome company to work for, that they might want to apply for?

Albert Saniger:

Thank you for that question. So we’re very unique in a few things. We are all working in person. We work in person from our two offices, New York office or London office. Not in a very prescriptive way. Some people just work from home a day or two, whenever they want to. We don’t force people into the office, but we are very much a culture of in-person work. People love being together. So if you are the kind of person who prefers to just stay at home or who moved to Bali and is working from Bali, which sounds awesome! That’s great. Just that Nate would not be for you. And instead, of you’re the kind of person who thrives in other in-person interactions then definitely Nate is for you. We live on five leadership principles. The first one is “self-care isn’t selfish.”

The second one is “disagreeing is healthy.” The third one is “make true promises.” The fourth one is “forgiveness over permission.” And the fifth one is “always look forward.” And each of those five have descriptions on our website if anyone wants to check them out. But yeah, those are primary ways in which we recruit and also the way we do performance reviews. And the last thing I’ll say is that we are at this like really fun intersection. We doubled the size of the team in the last four months. We’re about a hundred people now. We’re going to double it soon again too. And it’s a really interesting inflection point where you get to experience what an early stage company sort of maybe looked like into what a growth company is looking like. And it’s like this like really interesting sweet spot. And that is attracting a lot of very diverse talent. We have 28 nationalities, five religions, 49% women. And so far today we’ve had 98% offer acceptance rate. Every time we make an offer, 9.8 times out of ten, it’s accepted.

Kim Lantis:

Wow! I have to ask, this 49% of your women, are a lot of them in the engineering roles as well?

Albert Saniger:

In all functions, in all functions. For sure. In fact, our VP of Engineering is a woman. Yeah. She reports to me. She’s amazing.

Tullio Siragusa:

Women in STEM, we need more of that. Well, it sounds as though you guys are off to a great thing. So, congratulations. It’s been great to hear from you. You know, when you think like there’s a specific sector that seems to have matured or it’s being monopolized by a few big players, there’s always some other way. There’s always some better, more efficient, better aligned to what people want way that keeps up with the times. So congratulations for cornering the market with something that’s of value to many of us, especially those who desire more privacy and a better experience. So thanks for being with us, stay with us just a minute as we go off the air for wrap up. Carlos, what do we got coming up? We got two more shows right? Tomorrow and Thursday, right?

Carlos Ponce:

Yes. That is correct, Tullio. So let’s see. Tomorrow, right here on dojo.live, we are going to be speaking with Cenk Sidar, the Co-Founder and CEO of Enquire.ai. The topic is going to be “HL Collaboration in the Future of Work.” And then on Thursday, we will have Craig Fryar from Fundify. The topic will be “The Web and Your Wallet.” So that’s what we have right here on dojo.live, folks. So remember, join us tomorrow and Thursday right here on dojo.live at 12:00 PM Pacific for our dojo.live interviews, conversations, and remember, enjoy life, take care, and be safe. Cheers, everyone. Cheers. Crack open a cold one, crack open a cold one. Yeah.

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